Sports Goggles

Guilty Pettitte Walks Away an Innocent Hero – for Now

with 38 comments

posadajeter.jpgAndy Pettitte spoke publicly yesterday by way of a one-hour press conference at the New York Yankees spring training facilities in Tampa, Florida. He said he needed to talk, needed to get this, this ‘sin’ off his chest. He said he didn’t get injected with HGH and two years later inject himself with HGH to get better, stronger, or faster than he or anyone else in the Majors. He said he was just trying to get back on the field and do his job – so he did the HGH; he was taking one for the team. He said he was stupid He said he was desperate – well, probably desperate. He said he was sorry.

But Andy Pettitte does not even consider himself a cheater. Really, he doesn’t. He said so himself.

It was the MLB player version of open capitulation.

So why should we care?

Andy Pettitte’s reputation with the New York and national baseball press is so good that he causes non-baseball sportswriters to fawn by osmosis, by being in proximity to the typing of his name – A-N-D-Y P-E-T-T-I-T-T-E we genuflect, bow our heads, call other sportswriters and athletes and begin apologizing for prior acts of meanness.

We think for just a few seconds about what it would be like to live with the humility of Andy Pettitte and attempt, for just a minute to emulate ——– him. Be like Andy – Just Do It.

Yeah, I did it. I did something illegal. But did I cheat?

Hell no!

But did he misremember?

Andy can’t tell us. His lawyer interjected, cutting off all further questions and told us with all his lawyerly authority, that Pettitte cannot answer that question. Besides Pettitte will be called as a witness in the upcoming defamation lawsuit filed by Clemens against McNamee.

Is that the truth? No. did his lawyer lie? Yes ———– well, and no. But that’s law for you. Does Andy Pettitte know he can answer that question? Probably not.

pettitte.jpgBut Andy’s such a nice guy. He’s such a Southern gentleman. Brian McNamee and Roger Clemens are his friends and he hopes they remain his friends though he had to give a deposition and it is obvious that he told a story that was in some key respect vastly different than that of Clemens.

A story like, yes Roger Clemens was injected with HGH and steroids.

And then there were the Yankees on stage. Jorge Posada, Mariano Rivera and the New York Yankees god daddy Derek Jeter were sitting off to the side in a silent show of support and solidarity for their valued teammate; silently threatening MLB writers with their presence. ‘We’ll know exactly who asks the tough questions and we’ll remember you later when you come to the clubhouse and you need a quote,’ solidarity.

People have to stop askin’ questions about it first and foremost,” Jeter replied to a question after Pettitte’s press conference about how to “get over” this incident.

‘Stop. Asking. Questions. About it –

Capish?’

So, we cannot entertain the idea of anger toward Andy Pettitte; or disgust – or disappointment. Right?

Wrong.

Andy Pettitte put on his usual nice guy hat because that’s his demeanor. He’s a nicer guy than Roger Clemens. Or Barry Bonds.

So that means we can’t touch him.

Wrong.

Andy Pettitte is a cheat – period. A sheisty, nasty cheat. Not only did this guy get shot up by Brian McNamee more than he originally admitted to, but like an ex-junkie who, two years later wants to fire up just one more crack rock to see if he still wants it, he copped HGH from his daddy to get some ‘feel good’ for his aging pitcher body.

Then Mr. Nice Guy played the members of the press like a comfortable fiddler playing a traditional folk song, and played his lullaby till we all fell asleep smiling, dreaming Andy Pettitte on the mound striking out the final batter in this season’s World Series so we can all write stories of Andy Pettitte come full circle dreams.

Can I take a moment to finally spit out the dustball that is Andy Pettitte’s press conference that’s been in my throat since yesterday at about 3:30 p.m. yesterday?

Could we have fallen for Pettitte’s act any more than we already have?

I can see Andy Pettitte back in the clubhouse, ‘the fellas’ giving him backslaps, low fives, and brotha man handshakes.

And I can hear Andy Pettitte talking to Posada, Rivera, and Jeter: ‘Whaddya think? Did I slay ’em or what? It was like we were on the west coast and walked into a bar full of road bunnies with four or five stiff drinks in ’em; a little sweet talk and they were comin’ back to the hotel room.

‘They acted like what I was sayin’ was unscripted – that is some funny stuff right there. Man, let’s get out of here and go knock a few back.’

That is the reality of the reaction of athletes narrowly escaping potential trouble with the press. A press for whom they largely have a certain distaste, a press people like Andy Pettitte feels is about as necessary as an umpire is when he’s pitching.

Now don’t mistake what’s being said here for some sort of abject dislike of the man . Andy Pettitte seems like a really nice guy. He comes across like sweet and gentle and genteel man who is the kind of gentleman who would help old ladies across the street and sign autographs until his wrist is sore.

But.

Andy Pettitte is also today’s world-class athlete. He is driven – and he has his share of insecurities. The fear of losing is a much closer friend than is the reward of winning. But when he wins, he wants to reap the rewards for fighting through that fear.

He is no less a product of his times than many of the men and women in the press covering him. Ask them if they’d shoot some HGH if they were told it could help them write award-winning articles and help them become rich and famous.

They’d all say yes.

Ask them if they would, so stay rich and famous and writing stories, shoot some HGH even if they later got caught. The overwhelming majority of them would still say yes. And those who would say no say that because they know their personality is such that it closer to Roger Clemens’ or Barry Bonds’ than it is Andy Pettitte’s, and they’d probably lie or obfuscate —— instead of looking forthright and humble and telling a “kind of” truth.

We know Andy Pettitte shot up some HGH for whatever reason; probably to speed his comeback and max out his performance. Before Pettitte had a needle stuck in him he knew he was in the clear – no pun intended – and that there was no test for it. Then two years later when similar elbow problems cropped up he did some more.

And when busted Andy Pettitte relied on the cache he’d built up over all those years as a professional athlete on the grandest stage, a hero forged in the crucible that is Yankee Stadium.

Now, whether HGH is actually beneficial for men and adults in general, is another issue. Whether or not it should be legal is another conversation altogether. It is a conversation that is sorely needed; not just necessary – needed.

We need to know and understand the effects of HGH on the adult body. We need to know and understand the benefits of HGH and its deleterious effects if abused.

But that is not the reality of today.

The reality is, Andy Pettitte was illicitly injected with HGH and later, illicitly injected himself with HGH. And Andy Pettitte, just like every other baseball player who admitted to using HGH or steroids after the 1997 policy MLB Commissioner Bud Selig had posted in every MLB clubhouse, should be retroactively punished – harshly.

That is where we are today.

But we can’t even get Selig to admit that the 1997 policy existed as policy. We can’t even get the press top engage in a meaningful conversation about performance-enhancing drugs. We can’t even get the New York Yankees to admit that they are treating Andy Pettitte like a conquering hero while the same New York Yankees treated Jason Giambi like an enemy of state. And we can’t get the mainstream press to point out that disparity. As a result we won’t ever get Congress to reveal the true reason for wasting millions of dollars for the proceedings which culminated in the public testimonies of Roger Clemens and Brian McNamee – because they certainly were not held ‘for the kids.” We won’t gain any real knowledge of how many baseball players used or use steroids and/or HGH and how that might or might not have impacted the game itself.

And we can’t do any of that because we cannot execute the simple task of putting Andy Pettitte the person into the proper context so that we may more accurately assess his actions.

Besides, in the end, Andy Pettitte doesn’t feel he did anything wrong.

And if he doesn’t, why should we?

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38 Responses

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  1. Great article again Dwil. Man the press is all over this. Now they are saying Andy Pettitte is a hero.

    This is like an episode of the twilight zone.

    origin

    February 19, 2008 at 10:00 am

  2. Good article dwil.

    I wonder if Pettitte would be treated differently if he was a Hall-bound superstar with records to his name like Clemens or Bonds, or if he played somewhere other than New York or another big media market. This weird, contradictory coverage the baseball drugs scandal is getting from player to player and case to case is just head-scratching.

    motown

    February 19, 2008 at 10:10 am

  3. Thanks fellas….

    The, what if he was HOF-bound hypothesis, is a good one. What if he pitches three more seasons and wins 45 games over that time. With his present 14 playoff wins, that gives him 260 wins That puts Pettitte in HOF conversations.

    Now, that also means he’s Hall-eligible eight years from now; that a ways off and the conversation might have changed drastically by then.

    But. If it is close to what it is now, what happens to Pettitte?

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 10:27 am

  4. I don’t see a problem with Pettitte just like I don’t see one with Bonds and Clemens.

    They never failed tests so there should be no problem with any of them getting in.

    DavidMac

    February 19, 2008 at 10:31 am

  5. I see huge problems. As Dwil writes, he doesn’t have a problem with Pettite personally. He has the same problem a lot of folks have with the system of bullshit put out by MSM, the implied intimidation factor of Yankee players, the lawyering, obfuscation, and dissembling going on around Pettite and Clemens in order to make them different and purify them somehow amongst the thought-retards in fandom from Bonds. To give them an excuse, to excuse Clemens and Pettite, but not to excuse Bonds, against whom there is even flimsier evidence of rule breaking.

    I am at odds on the cheating aspect though. Some minor rules infraction, possibly. Cheating is such an onerous term. To me it equates recuperative medication with game throwing to win a bet. As in lying there can be degrees of harm from severe, to no harm at all. Another discussion for another time perhaps as you suggest. And I’m not really sure what differentiation your’re making Dwil, between necessity and need when referencing the further scientific investigation into PED use. Maybe you can clarify?

    E

    February 19, 2008 at 11:04 am

  6. Barry Bonds will NEVER lower himself like this! He has his rep to protect! Good job Barry, and good luck in Tampa Bay.

    http://barrybondstrial.blogspot.com/

    G Mitchell

    February 19, 2008 at 11:05 am

  7. Keep pointing out the hypocrisy man. Everybody can see how different certain players are treated, how their little lies are ignored. I’m glad the idea of an objective, unbiased media is dying a widespread death. Let us all remove that huge crutch from the media and force them to admit that they bring their own personal biases to every story.

    Allen

    February 19, 2008 at 11:26 am

  8. The only two people I can think of off the top of my head who were absolute locks for the HOF and got banned for off-field stuff were Shoeless Joe Jackson and Pete Rose. Of course, they were banned for gambling issues. But, the main difference between them and the PED players is that Jackson (almost certainly) and Rose (quite possibly) cheated to lose games. At the very least, you can say the PED players cheated in order to play better. Throwing games, especially the World Series in Jackson’s case, is a pretty serious affront to any sense of honesty or competition in baseball. I can’t give any insight into whether or not the modern Hall voters would feel similarly about steroids….I’ve never met a professional sportswriter in real life, certainly not one with a Hall vote. Once again, though, Jackson and Rose were high-profile legends. Maybe if its the difference between Pettitte getting in or not, the steroid issue might come back to bite him.

    motown

    February 19, 2008 at 11:28 am

  9. One more thing, back in Jackson and Rose’s day you didn’t have a couple dozen sportswriters and analysts arguing on ESPN, hundreds more writing about it online….is it possible that the over-analysis of this whole steroids issue will just kill it by itself? I mean, the gambling issues back in the day were covered just a little bit, and allowed to settle in to the minds of the public and fester. Now, you’ve got news and “analysis” rammed down your throat anytime you turn on any of the ESPNs or FSNs. If it helps make any sense what I’m trying to say, think about who (in any sport) it would take being named in a PED scandal at this point that would actually make you jump out of your chair, call your friends, anything more than a shrug and sigh. Is it even possible anymore? Already PED use just isn’t really as “offensive” as it was 3, 5, 10 years ago. In 10 more years, will anyone care?

    motown

    February 19, 2008 at 11:40 am

  10. …free Marion Jones!!

    grace

    February 19, 2008 at 11:58 am

  11. ..And, Mr. Pettite, you, are a bold-faced liar — a bible- reading, bold-faced liar.

    grace

    February 19, 2008 at 12:00 pm

  12. Thanks for the great article, Dwil.

    grace

    February 19, 2008 at 12:00 pm

  13. motown-
    Good points on what things might look like 10 years down the road. There will surely be new PEDs within 10 years, new dangers to “the kids.”

    I really feel the only way we avoid recurring events like the ones we just had with something entirely new is to shift the conversation to studies of PEDs and shared knowledge of their effects.

    Perhaps we need the equivalent of an open source software system, but with PEDs.

    grace-
    Thanks.

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 12:39 pm

  14. Why are we freeing Marion Jones?

    On Pettite: Just goes to show, America loves to forgive. Just say it nice, mention God, and apologize and we got your back.

    JB

    February 19, 2008 at 1:27 pm

  15. dwil,

    Don’t you wish you could find a way to get Jason Giambi’s real thoughts on the reception Pettite is receiving? Around this time last year, Jason was just tolerated by the Yankees.

    des

    February 19, 2008 at 1:31 pm

  16. I thought I was on Bizzaro world after I got home yesterday and saw the coverage of Andy Pettitte’s news conference. I thought that ESPN’s people treated Roger Clemens with kid gloves. They practically ordained Andy Pettitte a saint. I’ve always liked Pettitte. I thought George Steinbrenner made a mistake in trying to get rid of him one year, when Joe Torre convinced him to keep him by telling him he was one of the best postseason pitchers ever. However, if the press is going to imply that Barry Bonds cheated, and all they have to on is “Farce of Shadows”, then Andy Pettitte is a cheat. For that matter, when’s the federal government coming after Pettitte?
    In the grand scope of things, PED’s really doesn’t matter. I just wish that the MSM would stop claiming it’s unbiased when they’re the most biased people around. Maybe more of the mainstream sports media should take on Fox Sports mantra as being fair and balanced.

    kos

    February 19, 2008 at 1:34 pm

  17. er, I mean Fox News mantra.

    kos

    February 19, 2008 at 1:35 pm

  18. I can’t speak for Grace. But I personally see the incarceration of Marion Jones as a travesty and an outrage to anyone who believes that all citizens should be treated with just and righteous consistency by law enforcement specifically, and the government in general.

    1. Her check kiting conviction is a white collar offense. White males get pro on this ALL THE TIME. Sometimes with free rehab services kicked into boot.

    2. She has a small child in character development years that needs her mother. The community and society at large need this young girl to be with her mother. Her mother is a good person. A loving person. And she made a minor mistake that snowballed. But because she is a Black celebrity, she must be sacrificed at the altar of self-righteous MSM and the rabid racists who are given cover by them.

    And besides. I’m sick of hearing the whining about Prison overcrowding. Start solving it by releasing people who don’t belong there, and are no threat to themselves or others.

    3. The feds are treating her like a violent career criminal. which is a further pathetic degradation of our judicial system and its ability to carry credibility with thinking people everywhere. Its more mindful of medieval England and the post-reconstruction South of the 1880s.

    E

    February 19, 2008 at 2:00 pm

  19. E-
    Agreed on M. Jones…. completely.

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 2:14 pm

  20. Marion Jones goes to jail March 11th for a six month sentence. She lied to 2 federal grand juries. She lied in her book. She lied to you , me, she, he and everyone else for 7 years.
    Did I mention that she had lied to 2 federal grand juries?
    Her plea agreement (you know, the one she agreed to) allowed for this sentence to be imposed.
    But yet this is an injustice that brings E. to mind of medieval England and Reconstruction. And Dwil agrees completely.
    Sheesh.
    The only leniency I got for Marion Jones is that she has poor taste in men. (C.J. Hunter and Tim Montgomery)
    You saw how Andy Pettite flipped the script when it came time to talk to the Feds, right?

    JB

    February 19, 2008 at 2:30 pm

  21. JB-
    What got Jones her sentence, according to the judge, was that she lied to the feds. The other lies, which I have condemned if you bother to do a search and read what I have written about Jones, are for us to deal with.

    And yet, Andy Pettitte lied to the feds, hmmmm. Where is the zeal from the feds to go after him for his lies? Roger Clemens appear to have lied to the feds and he might not even be charged? Hmmmm. Where is the zeal to go after Clemens to find out whether or not he lied? Where is the zeal to convict we saw with Jones?

    Finally, how is it that the main dealer in a drug-related case – Victor Conte – got less time than the addict – Jones?

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 2:56 pm

  22. Andy Pettitte didn’t lie to the Feds. When it came time to talk to them, he came clean.
    Roger Clemens “appeared” to lie, when it can be PROVEN he lied he should most definitely be charged.
    Marion Jones has already ADMITTED she lied, something Barry B and Roger C. have yet to do.
    Victor Conte got 4 months in jail and 4 months of house arrest.
    Marion Jones not only lied in that case (the BALCO case), but also in the multi-million dollar money laundering case her ex-boyfriend Tim Montgomery was involved in (sentence 37-46 months).
    So again, where is the injustice here?
    I’m just sayin’ you gotta pick who you fight for, if you wanna say M. Vick got screwed over, I’m right there with you, he most definitely got shafted. M. Jones I don’t get.

    JB

    February 19, 2008 at 3:06 pm

  23. Andy Pettitte didn’t go in front of a grand jury, or two. Andy Pettitte is an accessory to this entire Roger Clemens’ debacle, not an active participant. It is not Andy the feds are after, it’s Roger.

    flip it…

    Marion Jones admitted to lying, and agreed to the terms of her jail time. A lot of criminals have children that are in their prime learning stage of their lives when crimes occur, not just Marion Jones. There should be no sympathy for a person who commits a crime, especially if they admit to it.

    dwil, you said “Roger Clemens appear to have lied to the feds and he might not even be charged”, how you do know? It’s been what, 3 days??? Unless McNamee backs down, 99 percent chance this is going to a perjury trial. There is always zeal to convict someone as popular as a professional athlete or popular figure.

    To reply to your question with a question, how come the final guy in the Michael Vick case, the one who squeeled like a rat, got less time than the others? Because he sang his song the prettiest when asked to provide information. Jones should go to jail, she committed a crime, and she admitted to it. No, she’s not a murderer or a lifer, but she does need to learn that committing a felony is not just a slap on the wrist, or a turn of the page…

    Boney

    February 19, 2008 at 3:17 pm

  24. Wow….they’re gonna script this whole thing right into High School Musical 3 – I can already see it…the athlete (probably that curly haired boy) takes some magic pill, lies..then comes clean..teammates hug him, everyone rallies around him…and then the big song/dance finale on “the truth is good”. Oh well, maybe the song will have a nice beat.

    Miranda

    February 19, 2008 at 4:28 pm

  25. Boney-
    Marion Jones admitted to lying, and agreed to the terms of her jail time. A lot of criminals have children that are in their prime learning stage of their lives when crimes occur, not just Marion Jones. There should be no sympathy for a person who commits a crime, especially if they admit to it.

    Then charge every single person, from Rick Ankiel ro Rodney Harrison to Andy Pettitte to Roger Clemens because they all admitted to committing crimes. All of them.

    JB-
    The check fraud charge has never had a dollar amount attached to it other than the $25,000 attached to Jones – so, “multi-million dollar scheme”, which you took off some website or another is n fact, when it comes to Jones, exactly $25,000. so please do not stretch the truth to fit your ends.

    And yes, a six month jail sentence to be served in jail for a mother of young children is much harsher that a four and four sentence especially when four of those months are served in one’s home…. I don’t give a damn how many mothers have serve similar sentences for petty-ass crimes.

    And then to say that a total of eight months for the illegal manufacture drugs and the selling of them is commensurate to the act? And because he rolled over on users that allows him a reduced sentence?

    WTF?!

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 5:46 pm

  26. Boney

    No sympathy for people who commit crimes?

    Do you speed?

    Drive tipsy?

    Shit, that’s a harsh standard no matter how you stand on Marion Jones.

    No sympathy for anyone who commits a crime?

    Guess you weren’t a big fan of the civil rights movement, huh?

    Allen

    February 19, 2008 at 6:29 pm

  27. Book on cheerleaders and PED’s: http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2008/02/bring-it-on-che.html just FYI, D-Wil.

    mcbias

    February 19, 2008 at 7:36 pm

  28. mc-
    Thanks.

    and Boney and JB-
    Since when did a manufacturer and dealer get his sentence reduced for snitching down instead of up?

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 8:15 pm

  29. Allen, I have no sympathy for people who commit crimes and get caught or admit to their crimes. I do not involve myself in illegal activity, nor do I put myself in a position to be guilty in a court of law. I have sped, and I’ve been caught. Do any of you feel sorry for that? I mean, twice I got caught speeding I was driving to my mom’s house, dwil would have you believe driving to your mom’s house allows you all the freedom in the world.

    The thing is Allen, if I went to court to contest my speeding tickets, and plead not guilty, got on the stand and proclaimed innocence to the jury, and then came out as the gov’t was trying to charge me with perjury and admitted to my crime, shouldn’t I go to jail for being not only guilty, but wasting the government’s time during the initial trial and then subsequent information gathering for the perjury trial?

    If no, then I want to live in the country you’re running when you’re elected into office one day.

    Yes, I am a fan of the civil rights movement. People shouldn’t be mistreated if others are not simply because of the color of their skin, religion, background, sexuality, etc. I know, it’s hard to believe since I don’t agree with every single syllable of every single word you type… but it’s true! I swear!

    Boney

    February 19, 2008 at 8:32 pm

  30. dwil, since long before Brian McNamee was told he wouldn’t see jail time if he turned over names that ended up in the Mitchell report… I promise, loooooooooong before.

    Why isn’t McNamee in jail? Because his knowledge was part of a research study showing the abuse of PEDs in baseball? What does that really have to do with anything? Does PED use/abuse in baseball, football, basketball hamper the success of this country?

    Technically Clemens (if found guilty), Bonds (if found guilty), Pettitte, Ankiel, Tejada and any of the people in the Mitchell Report are criminals according to law.

    Where is all the talk though about Miguel Tejada? He isn’t even getting a committee hearing, his case is running straight to the federal court for perjury. Is Tejada not a big enough name for you to cover dwil? Or do you prefer to just keep talking about Clemens and Pettitte? Where’s the fair and equal coverage that you pander for from the MSM?

    Boney

    February 19, 2008 at 8:37 pm

  31. Boney-
    The 1st 3 paragraphs of your comment are jibberish. I have almost no clue of what you are trying to say.

    I said ALL of them should be charged with possession of illicit drugs. And no, not Bonds because he hasn’t admitted to anything. However, where are the possession charges fro ALL of them. Where is the manufacturer and distribution charge for Victor Conte?

    All of you want to fucking split hairs when it behooves your cause.

    McNamee was pursued by the federal government, so that research study talk is basically bullshit. All of the people you named other than Bonds have admitted to being in the possession of prescription-only drugs w/out a prescription. Why have they not been charged? There is no if

    How does Victor Conte NOT face the manufacture and distribution charges? ??

    And with Tejada’s case… How the fuck do you know what I have or haven’t compiled about Tejada? I don’t put writing out for your fucking schedule. And as I’ve told others who write stupid shit like that, it is disgusting to me that a person would dare attempt to dictate what I should write and when I should write it. It’s best to keep that dumb shit to yourself…. Like you have access to my computer folders – asshole.

    dwil

    February 19, 2008 at 9:14 pm

  32. Boney:

    Your sycophantic law n’ order talking points are almost word for word the same talking points that came out of the Nixon “Silent Majority” campaign in 1968 and have continued to be thrown about like so much confetti from the Gong Show ever since.

    Its sloganeering and argumentative without aforethought. And your “I don’t break the law” holier than thou mantra is so cut n’ paste from talk-radio, it hardly warrants a response. As a matter of fact it doesn’t. Go read “law-n-order for dummies. com” if you want to engage in I’m-better-than-you, drivel.

    Believe it or not, good folks break the law all time. People steal food to feed themselves. (Like you never picked a piece of fruit from a tree that you did not own?) They sneak onto public transportation because they lack carfare. There’s no garbage cans, so they litter. They get mugged and have their money stolen, so they shoplift. They get their licenses lifted because they can’t afford to register their cars and drive them anyway to their minimum wage jobs. Then they get arrested for driving without a license to their minimum wage jobs and get their cars confiscated. It happens hundreds of times a day. It happens. All. The. Time. Everything starts small. Then it snowballs. The feds know that. They count on it. They wait and wait and wait. Then they pounce. And then people like you wag your fingers in their faces and scold, ridicule and demand a pound of flesh and demand penitentiary time for mothers who are scared shitless and fib to a bunch of overeducated obfuscating government prosecuters, investigators, cops, and dozens of others.

    It is fairly typical for narrow minded folks to claim personal innocence, which somehow gives them the right to declare a pox on people who get caught up in this kind of grind.

    Your whole self-serving vignette about speeding to Grama’s house in your little red riding hood is irrelevant. Its a false analogy.

    I cannot have a meaningful discussion with somebody who lacks empathy. It is apparent you have no capacity to understand what it is like to walk in the shoes of another. This isn’t the first time with you. I can assure you its the last. At least until you grow up and come up with some original thought instead of echoing the 530 to 1710 KHz radio band.

    E

    February 19, 2008 at 9:29 pm

  33. Dwil,

    Since when does a manufacturer and dealer get his sentence reduced for snitching down instead of up?

    When his snitching up implicates the wrong people. McNamee snitching up would mostly implicate the MLB owners, Conte snitching up could implicate dozens of high ranking coaches in the US Olympic program. All of whom knew about the doping scandals long before the media or authorities would have.

    They got deals not to implicate the money people. Everyone else is collateral damage to keep the heat off the real criminals

    Cpt.Sunsine

    February 19, 2008 at 10:43 pm

  34. Boney,

    Seems to have a problem with people who commit crimes and get caught. As is implied by his speeding story. So as long as you don’t get caught commiting the crime, Boney is ok with it.

    With regards to Marion Jones, lying to the Feds may be a crime, but as far as I’m concerned it’s poetic justice. The department of justice doesn’t deserve the truth, because for years they have lived in a lie, they are a lie in name and existence. When the federal government as a whole quits lying to the people, perhaps then I’ll be outraged by someone returning the favor.

    johnny g

    February 20, 2008 at 12:02 am

  35. Cpt.-
    Really…

    lohnny-
    If you’re not careful, too much truth will land you in an inane argument.

    dwil

    February 20, 2008 at 12:52 am

  36. When they went to M. Jones and said do you know about any of this BALCO stuff under oath and on penalty of perjury, she said no, she wasn’t involved.
    And when they went to M. Jones and said do you know about this $25,000 fake check from this fake 5 million dollar account set up by your boyfriend and his friends under oath and on penalty of perjury, she said no, she wasn’t involved.
    So after doing that, she then admits, after seeing the preponderance of evidence against her, that she was involved and signs a plea agreement allowing for a maximum 6- month jail sentence and then gets sentenced by the judge to 6 months in jail.
    Victor Conte did not lie to a federal grand jury.
    If Marion Jones had just told the truth in her 2 grand jury appearances she would not be going to jail now. (well, on March 11th)

    JB

    February 20, 2008 at 8:42 am

  37. E,

    Your ramblings of why I’m wrong and everyone else is right amused me. It moved me a little bit after a tear welled up in my eye when reading about how when people get mugged so they shoplift. Then I took a minute to think of how that relates to Marion Jones. Just like I tried to think for a second about how driving tipsy and getting speeding tickets related to Marion Jones.

    I thought long and hard.. I really did… and I came up with:

    99 percent of people would admit guilt if caught shoplifting because they got mugged. Bet on it. I admitted guilt in my previous moving violations. I would admit guilt if I were actually driving drunk. There is no holier than thou attitude in any of those 3 statements. It’s called being honest.. I don’t think I’m better than Marion Jones, Andy Pettitte or Roger Clemens just because they’re guilty or about to go to trial. As usual, the hate flies back at an opposing thought before the hater takes a dose of his own medicine, and actually reads what is written. Did you mis-read? Don’t compare my words to talk radio or tv or gong shows, richard nixon, etc… The only talk radio I listen to is a morning sports’ show in the DC area that’s not even really sports related anymore. They don’t talk about Marion Jones, Bonds, Clemens, etc… I don’t watch Fox News, CNN, etc… I watch my local news, for local reports. I’m not a republican, my family never owned slaves, I am white but I’m not always right, etc. I don’t need to read history books to form an opinion on things. I just learned recently that distant members of my father’s side of the family fought against americans in WWII, but I don’t hate jews, blacks, americans, etc. I’m not so weak minded that I need a Rush Limbaugh or a Don Imus to form an opinion for me. You can call me names, but if you want to compare me to anything, please compare it to something that has happened since 1980.

    You know when you’re younger how you had one of the “cool” teachers who might have candy or crayons available for your use and they’d say “I’m leaving these out for everyone to use, if you use it or take it, leave money or put it back. We’re using the honor system”. Remember? Remember there was always a kid that would eat up all the candy or always take the popular crayons home with him because there was nothing to keep him from stealing so it ruined it for everyone? But if that kid admitted guilt, the setup would remain? If he didn’t, depending on the stuff they took and if they got caught, they’d get detention or suspended?

    Why shouldn’t Marion Jones go to jail? Why shouldn’t Clemens go to jail if found guilty? Marion’s had her day in court, she chose to be dishonest, so she’s cooked. Clemens should have his day in court, not just in front of a judiciary committee. Andy Pettitte is no hero, he didn’t lie when pressed. His image will take a hit for lying initially and then coming clean when pressed. If I had a newborn baby as a single father, and I got a DUI and had to go to jail noone would feel sorry for my kid. Why should Marion Jones get the benefit of the doubt?

    If Jones doesn’t go to jail like me, you, Allen, and dwil would if we lied, then what’s the point in having a trial for her involvement in BALCO and fraudelent checks?

    dwil,

    I know why you promote Andy Pettitte and Clemens and Ankiel, etc and all the negativity surrounding them. My statement to you was a request, the same request you make to the MSM on a daily basis. Miguel Tejada is not getting a judiciary committee hearing, he’s “passed GO” and he’s about to collect a trial if the evidence is there.

    Boney

    February 20, 2008 at 12:21 pm

  38. […] used it a second time, he was treated much more favorably by media and fans. He has even been lauded as a hero by many for stepping up and taking responsibility for his […]


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